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High DPS Warrior buildFollow

#1 Apr 08 2011 at 5:28 PM Rating: Decent
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I have been trying to find a really good single-target DPS warrior build and have tried all of the obvious ones but can't seem to produce more than 400dps on average. I may be having trouble with the build or maybe the rotation? I am on mostly T1 armor with 100+ hit rating. Any suggestions?

I can produce a little over 500 with a beastmaster pet but I don't want to have to count on the pet for my dps.

Edited, Apr 8th 2011 7:29pm by rsnacks

Edited, Apr 8th 2011 8:18pm by rsnacks
#2 Apr 09 2011 at 11:51 AM Rating: Default
28 posts
Looks like BM/Champion/Paragon is still going to be the top DPS.

I'm seeing 850+ DPS self buffed.

http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0ckmu.EhczVobhhzz.xE0bVzu.q
-Top DPS if you are hit capped.

http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0ckmu.EAczV00h0zz.EE0bVzu.M
-Top DPS if you are not hit capped.

If you really don't want to rely on a pet then you can go Champion/Paragon/Riftblade. Paragon Dual Wield is doing 550-750 DPS. Champion 2hander is doing 600-800 DPS.

Haven't tried full riftblade, but I doubt its good now since they semi-nerfed it.
#3 Apr 11 2011 at 12:53 PM Rating: Decent
3 posts
Here's what I've seen so far:

Clear winner:
24/30/12 (BM/champ/para)

After more than 100 pages of discussion on rift official forums, no one is really disputing that BM is on top.


No pet Winners (I'm a warrior not a hunter!):

This is very good before you have good gear, and may still be on top even after (disputed):
38/20/8 (RB/Para/Void)

This scales much better with gear, has better AOE capability with TS. At some point in gearing this will pass the RB spec above. The rotation is tighter, and optimal rotations are still being discussed (1/2 finishers between SLI, etc). Energy starved without chloro/bard as well (so will not perform well self buffed on dummy):
38/20/8 (Champ/Para/Void)



Obviously, similar variation of all three specs (such as that posted by infernix above), will produce similar results.

Fingers crossed that Trion stops forcing top end min/max warriors to bring a pet with them.

Edited, Apr 11th 2011 2:57pm by Redamntion
#4 Apr 11 2011 at 1:34 PM Rating: Good
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Redamntion wrote:
Here's what I've seen so far:

Clear winner:
24/30/12 (BM/champ/para)

After more than 100 pages of discussion on rift official forums, no one is really disputing that BM is on top.


No pet Winners (I'm a warrior not a hunter!):

This is very good before you have good gear, and may still be on top even after (disputed):
38/20/8 (RB/Para/Void)

This scales much better with gear, has better AOE capability with TS. At some point in gearing this will pass the RB spec above. The rotation is tighter, and optimal rotations are still being discussed (1/2 finishers between SLI, etc). Energy starved without chloro/bard as well (so will not perform well self buffed on dummy):
38/20/8 (Champ/Para/Void)



Obviously, similar variation of all three specs (such as that posted by infernix above), will produce similar results.

Fingers crossed that Trion stops forcing top end min/max warriors to bring a pet with them.

Edited, Apr 11th 2011 2:57pm by Redamntion


I'd be interested in seeing these builds if you wouldn't mind linking them instead of just providing numbers? Smiley: wink
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#5 Apr 11 2011 at 1:43 PM Rating: Good
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There is no way 8 in void is a good idea. Str, and by extension AP in this game are not that great not to mention the true uptime of of Ravenous Strength. Totally not worth it, leave VK to the tanks.

in the first build, 8 pts in champ would be unbelievably better and in the second, pts into RB would be better than VK.

#6 Apr 11 2011 at 5:25 PM Rating: Decent
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http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0ckuh.E0cd0RzG0z.Ve0c0AzcM.Vx

I am currently testing this build and it seems to be outputting fairly good single target dps... I tried a 51 para build but there is no survivability while soloing/pvp. The aoe dungeon spec I am currently working with is this...

http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0ckmu.EAzdqRrGzbz.Vxxb0z.m

I am testing it because I want to see if using BM without a pet is worth it (BM strictly for buffs). I know a few points in the Champ tree are wasted points, but I needed 44 pts for CB.

Please let me know what you all think of these. Criticism welcome.
#7 Apr 12 2011 at 11:19 AM Rating: Decent
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@KTurner. Nice to have concrete evidence from the authority on PVE Warrior theorycrafting... /sarcasm
ZuKii explains the reasoning behind the void choice below. If you find a way to gain > 70 DPS with 8 points anywhere else, by all means...

"The idea isn't to use the 50% more strength, the idea is literally just to use Furious Rage. It's a 6 sec CD non-GCD that interrupts and does weapon damage which is great for our 2hander Riftblade.

It basically adds around 70 DPS.

What can 8 points spent elsewhere get?
- Champ gets more Power Regen which is useless because we never run out (+10% str which is nice to have but not going to give +70 DPS).
- Paragon gives improved flowing strikes / force of will. More damage on rising waterfall is nice but not 70 DPS.
- Improved flowing strikes is again nice but imo not needed. Any other points spent would be on defensive abilities.
- 8 more in Riftblade would get a new blade which we wouldn't use because we need Planar. It also wouldn't increase elemental damage at all because it's already capped.
- 8 in Warlord / Paladin gives no damage increasing stuff
- 8 points in Reaver I thought about. It gives you a DoT that does weapon damage + amount so you might not miss out on too much by using. It might even be effected by Riftblade's "Rift Fury" but it's on GCD.
I haven't actually parsed it so someone might want to and get back to me... Maybe there's a Reaver/Riftblade build out there where you stack DoTs, use Infestation and don't draw aggro because of reduced threat from RB tree... who knows." - ZuKii


-----


@Callinon:
Here are the builds, parsed and discussed extensively on the official forums.
Again, minor variations compete and may outperform in some circumstances.


(Cookie Cutter-ish) BM build:
Disadvantage: Reliant on pet, something many warriors have been trying to avoid. However, BM IS the highest dps spec at the moment, without much argument.


Heavy RB Build 1
Heavy RB Build 2
Disadvantage: Doesn't scale well with gear


Heavy Champ Build
Disadvantage: Energy starvation even with bard/chloro. Requires very good gear to be effective.


@ everyone else:
Please don't bother to post if you only plan to say "you're wrong" without any evidence. This is the last time I'll bite. Questions and comments that are actually relevant are welcome.


#8 Apr 12 2011 at 11:32 AM Rating: Good
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Post your evidence of this being the best then.

I understand the importance of using the off GCD abilities. In the builds you are linking, i would use Flinching Strike and save myself the 8 pts in VK and invest in a tree that would boosts the damage on top of that, or help in my energy regen. edit: didnt realize flinching was on a 10sec CD. wtf is up with that? Anyways, if raid buffed you could probably get away with using bash in there. dunno though.

Your post without parses holds just as much water as mine does. Id like to see a parse comparing your builds with VK using furious rage, and my builds using flinching strike.

I also wouldnt be too surprised if you linked me your source and I found out it was disputed by everyone. I do read the official forums when im in a mood to tolerate high levels of stupidity (there are some good posters on there), and this is the first ive heard anyone using VK for dps.



Edited, Apr 12th 2011 11:45am by KTurner
#9 Apr 12 2011 at 11:48 AM Rating: Good
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Redamntion wrote:

@Callinon:
Heavy RB Build 1
Heavy RB Build 2
Disadvantage: Doesn't scale well with gear


The only difference I see between these two specs is that one takes Rift Surge and the other takes Freeze Armor... this does not seem to be huge to me. The other thing I've noticed is they BOTH take Improved Avatars and I seriously can't see why you would do that in anything other than a 51-pt build, because outside of improving Avatar of the Rift this doesn't contribute anything to dps. You COULD have taken Improved Fork and the other of Rift Surge/Freeze Armor. Freeze Armor is also not a dps increase without IFA but a range snare on a short cooldown has GOT to be more useful than 5% more dodge on Avatar of Wind, and certainly Imp. Fork is more useful than that.

The other thing I see here that confuses me IS the 8 points in void knight. Now I could kind of understand where you'd be going with that as anything but a Riftblade. Strength (and AP) means very little to Riftblade, which is part of your comment about bad scaling, so the potential 50% strength (25% extra ap from strength by extension) while technically a largish number, isn't that great. You say that the root ability you get at 8-pt Void Knight is the reason for that, but I just don't see it. Off the GCD stuff is cool, but Riftblade should have plenty of things to do already without it.

I'd like to see parses that indicate that ability is worth the 8 points it cost to get it. Frankly I think I'd rather have 8 points in Reaver, Paladin, or 8 more in Paragon with 0-pt Warlord
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#10 Apr 12 2011 at 1:20 PM Rating: Decent
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Excellent. Some real discussion.
And I agree, the stupidity on the official forums is difficult to sift through, and I'm left with a headache on a good day. Hopefully ZAM will uphold a slightly better standard.

---

In these builds, I was not trying to state that they are THE builds to go with.
I was providing them more as templates to build off. It's why I tried to add caveats that variations exist and perform well.

@Callinon
re: Avatar - These are definitely points you can spill around to the utility you prefer. I take avatar for the damage reduction bonus to water (especially given I'm not very geared yet) for survivability in heavy AOE fights. You are right that fork could provide some extra cleave/util in some situations. I'd hazard to say that freeze armor (w/o improved) is not very valuable at all in any boss fight. w/ improved it's an argument whether you get an overall dps increase (hence my two builds)

re: Void - The idea is that it's an off GCD ability that can be macro'd into your AP builder. Given that we're not really energy starved with this build, it's just extra dps at a very low energy cost. As stated before, I make no claims that the STR bonus means almost anything. Even on a boss with mana, on a good day, we're talking maybe 20dps increase. As far as parses, you can easily take this in and out of any of your macros to see the roughly 70 DPS increase I claim. These 8 points are arguable, but I just haven't found anyone that's explained a way to spend them that (even theoretically) yields more than 70 DPS. I also haven't found such a way (although Reaver definitely has a chance. I'll play around with that soon).

@Kturner -
re: "disputed" - When I say things "are not being disputed", take it with a grain of salt. There's lots of retards on those forums, so everything is "disputed" by someone. Also, the only thing I said "wasn't disputed" is that BM is on top. Which I think is a pretty common theme. VK in this spec IS disputed, however from my investigation so far, and from the better posters in those mud filled forums, it's what I believe to be best at the moment. The post where it was first introduced (from what I've found) is the 100+ page post in the Warrior forums. ZuKii and Ransac start talking about it around page 55 I think.

re: Flinching Strike - I believe our energy regen in these builds supports the use of both FS and FR in our AP builder macro. I'm interested in trying your RB spec, if you don't mind posting it in this thread.

Edited, Apr 12th 2011 4:20pm by Redamntion
#11 Apr 12 2011 at 2:43 PM Rating: Good
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http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0cuLE.Vex00A00M.EMotzsbGtz

This is the Riftblade spec I've been using at 50. I found that it can put out pretty decent dps even with gear that isn't terribly good. That being said it may only BE good at low gear levels due to Riftblade's poor scaling.

The last 2 points in Paragon are variable. You can stick one in Touch of Tranquility if you need some extra CC, you can stick one or two in Force of Will to make Rising Waterfall sort of ridiculous. By taking 28 points in Paragon and using a dual wield spec you get nearly the full benefit from Teaching of the Five Rings (it caps out at 29 points, but you don't have that many to spend).

You do have a point about Freeze Armor not being super good without IFA, but for 1 point you get a ranged snare on a short cooldown which can have some corner case utility and gives you the ability to kite when solo with ease, all for 1 measly point. I suppose if you want something that could be a direct dps increase you could stick the point in Rift Storm for added AoE damage, but I personally hate Rift Storm and everything it stands for, so I chose to put it in Freeze Armor instead Smiley: grin

EDIT: Please note I only use this spec for dungeons, groups, and kiting elites solo. It has next to no survivability in normal solo play and that's intentional

Edited, Apr 12th 2011 3:51pm by Callinon
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#12 Apr 12 2011 at 3:09 PM Rating: Good
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Archmage Callinon wrote:
http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0cuLE.Vex00A00M.EMotzsbGtz

This is the Riftblade spec I've been using at 50. I found that it can put out pretty decent dps even with gear that isn't terribly good. That being said it may only BE good at low gear levels due to Riftblade's poor scaling.

The last 2 points in Paragon are variable. You can stick one in Touch of Tranquility if you need some extra CC, you can stick one or two in Force of Will to make Rising Waterfall sort of ridiculous. By taking 28 points in Paragon and using a dual wield spec you get nearly the full benefit from Teaching of the Five Rings (it caps out at 29 points, but you don't have that many to spend).

You do have a point about Freeze Armor not being super good without IFA, but for 1 point you get a ranged snare on a short cooldown which can have some corner case utility and gives you the ability to kite when solo with ease, all for 1 measly point. I suppose if you want something that could be a direct dps increase you could stick the point in Rift Storm for added AoE damage, but I personally hate Rift Storm and everything it stands for, so I chose to put it in Freeze Armor instead Smiley: grin

EDIT: Please note I only use this spec for dungeons, groups, and kiting elites solo. It has next to no survivability in normal solo play and that's intentional

Edited, Apr 12th 2011 3:51pm by Callinon


I dont see the logic tbh.

Speccing hard into RB with the obvious goal to get rift strike (air damage, not increased by Teaching of the Five Rings), then focusing on abilities that dont supplement it. I mean, isnt the entire point of RBs strength at lower gear levels the elemental damage the tree offers? Am i missing something?

I would go 20 in Para for 5/5 flowing strikes. Then put at least 5 into champ for the 10% finisher bonus or 5+ into reaver for binding of affliction. Also a 2H would be used.

Edited, Apr 12th 2011 2:11pm by KTurner
#13 Apr 12 2011 at 3:22 PM Rating: Good
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KTurner wrote:
Archmage Callinon wrote:
http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0cuLE.Vex00A00M.EMotzsbGtz

This is the Riftblade spec I've been using at 50. I found that it can put out pretty decent dps even with gear that isn't terribly good. That being said it may only BE good at low gear levels due to Riftblade's poor scaling.

The last 2 points in Paragon are variable. You can stick one in Touch of Tranquility if you need some extra CC, you can stick one or two in Force of Will to make Rising Waterfall sort of ridiculous. By taking 28 points in Paragon and using a dual wield spec you get nearly the full benefit from Teaching of the Five Rings (it caps out at 29 points, but you don't have that many to spend).

You do have a point about Freeze Armor not being super good without IFA, but for 1 point you get a ranged snare on a short cooldown which can have some corner case utility and gives you the ability to kite when solo with ease, all for 1 measly point. I suppose if you want something that could be a direct dps increase you could stick the point in Rift Storm for added AoE damage, but I personally hate Rift Storm and everything it stands for, so I chose to put it in Freeze Armor instead Smiley: grin

EDIT: Please note I only use this spec for dungeons, groups, and kiting elites solo. It has next to no survivability in normal solo play and that's intentional

Edited, Apr 12th 2011 3:51pm by Callinon


I dont see the logic tbh.

Speccing hard into RB with the obvious goal to get rift strike (air damage, not increased by Teaching of the Five Rings), then focusing on abilities that dont supplement it. I mean, isnt the entire point of RBs strength at lower gear levels the elemental damage the tree offers? Am i missing something?

I would go 20 in Para for 5/5 flowing strikes. Then put at least 5 into champ for the 10% finisher bonus or 5+ into reaver for binding of affliction. Also a 2H would be used.

Edited, Apr 12th 2011 2:11pm by KTurner


You're not wrong, unfortunately there's really nothing outside of the riftblade tree that boosts riftblade's attacks.

You spec into Rift Strike because the crit chance increase is not specific to riftblade. This build ends up using about a 60/40 spread between riftblade and paragon attacks, the point is for the crits to cascade off of each other between rift strike and flowing strikes you end up with a pretty good crit rate and pretty decent burst. You've got enough points into RB and Para for their respective "spend points in me" branches to work to their fullest. You've got Weapon Master which fires all the **** time so virtually every 2 or 3 attacks is a finisher (either SLI or a burst).

I realize it seems like it should be a pile of crap, but in fact this build does pretty decent dps, though I did make the caveat about this being possibly limited to low gear levels
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#14 Apr 12 2011 at 3:30 PM Rating: Good
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Im sure it does work, but i think it can be optimized by focusing more on the RB attacks, and using a 2H weapon.

Im actually going to try the build out tonight (my version mind you:P ). I really hate BM even though it works well.

My gear is rubbish so it might really help out.

And it..... sucks. :( top out at about 490 against a regular target dummy, might be able to break 500 with some energy regen and using storm blade. Even my personal dps with BM was better than that. Im disappointed. Maybe i was doing something wrong and can work some kinks out of it.

Edited, Apr 12th 2011 9:43pm by KTurner
#15 Apr 13 2011 at 8:32 AM Rating: Good
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Im beginning to think your build probably produced better dps than what i came up with, Callinon. A lot of my damage came from physicals and Rising Waterfall, and since i dont have DW weapons im going to parse this tonight and see how i fair.

Does anyone know if you can change weapons in combat? i know you cant change armor. Id like to be able to switch to dual wield in combat and have some range viability (hence the point in path of the tempest)

Edited, Apr 13th 2011 7:32am by KTurner
#16 Apr 13 2011 at 8:40 AM Rating: Good
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KTurner wrote:

Does anyone know if you can change weapons in combat? i know you cant change armor. Id like to be able to switch to dual wield in combat and have some range viability (hence the point in path of the tempest)


You can indeed, actually that's gotten me into trouble a few times when I've thought I was out of combat but wasn't
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#17 Apr 26 2011 at 5:58 PM Rating: Decent
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It seem that this thread is getting more attention so I want to post my proposed build.

I have a build that's based on a Paragon build that I would like to get others' feedback and discussion.

It's a 32 Para/26 Champ/ 8 BM
rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0ckum.E0czoRbG0z.Vex00A0cR.Vh

Pros:
Increased hit % to ease with gear choices
Very, very energy efficient, even in heavy, constant AoE situations
Very high AoE capabilities
Somewhat of a pro, no pet to have to manage and hope it doesn't die mid-combat

Cons:
No pet to increase damage
No CC abilities, except maybe the AoE fear in the Champ tree

I've read that Deadly Grace isn't working always and that should bring our damage up a bit, but I'm still unsure if it will bring us up to this Champ/BM/Para 2H build that's supposedly ripping apart bosses.

I tried the above mentioned spec and found I ran out of energy quite quickly, even in group situations. And that was just single target too. I also didn't use the above mentioned priority where you include the bleeds, but I'm fairly certain that would've just made the problem worse.

I like my spec that I linked especially since it's extremely efficient on energy. Even in heavy AoE fights, I never seem to go below 50 power. And with as many fights as there are with adds, having as much cleave-type abilities seems desirable.

Also, I don't know how dated it is still, but is Path of Raptor still a better follow-up attack than Rising Waterfall, or did they fix that when they added a cooldown to it?

Any feedback would be terrific, thanks in advance.
#18 May 03 2011 at 7:52 AM Rating: Decent
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infernix18 wrote:
Looks like BM/Champion/Paragon is still going to be the top DPS.

I'm seeing 850+ DPS self buffed.

http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0ckmu.EhczVobhhzz.xE0bVzu.q
-Top DPS if you are hit capped.

http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0ckmu.EAczV00h0zz.EE0bVzu.M
-Top DPS if you are not hit capped.

If you really don't want to rely on a pet then you can go Champion/Paragon/Riftblade. Paragon Dual Wield is doing 550-750 DPS. Champion 2hander is doing 600-800 DPS.

Haven't tried full riftblade, but I doubt its good now since they semi-nerfed it.


Can you please supply the rotation for these builds?
#19 May 04 2011 at 7:24 AM Rating: Decent
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I am really looking for a serious discussion on this. Is this the place to come to? Are there other sites that provide a more in depth discussion? It seems like the few places I have looked are not responded to regularly sometimes going days without a post. I have also found the official forums about 75% garbage and having to wade through all of the nonsense to get to a decent post is mind numbing.
Thanks ahead of time.

Mithras - Shatterbone
#20 May 04 2011 at 9:37 AM Rating: Good
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It seems like the official forums and Zam have the most active communities right now (and you're right, the O-boards are 80% slog whereas Zam's community doesn't really allow for that).

There's already been great discussion in this thread about warrior builds as well as other threads with other callings/souls. Take a look around, jump in and discuss. Take a look at the guides we've already written here, they're good.
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#21 May 04 2011 at 8:33 PM Rating: Decent
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Thanks for the response, yeah I have read thru most of the posts here, good stuff. I see you are from Chi-town, Go Bulls!! I live way down in Lincoln, IL. Anyway, I will use these boards as my standard for discussion.
#22 May 05 2011 at 1:35 AM Rating: Decent
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infernix18 wrote:
Looks like BM/Champion/Paragon is still going to be the top DPS.

I'm seeing 850+ DPS self buffed.

http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0ckmu.EhczVobhhzz.xE0bVzu.q
-Top DPS if you are hit capped.

http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0ckmu.EAczV00h0zz.EE0bVzu.M
-Top DPS if you are not hit capped.

If you really don't want to rely on a pet then you can go Champion/Paragon/Riftblade. Paragon Dual Wield is doing 550-750 DPS. Champion 2hander is doing 600-800 DPS.

Haven't tried full riftblade, but I doubt its good now since they semi-nerfed it.

I'm also interested in rotation information on these particular specs. Particularly the first one.
Thanks for the great info.
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