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Why does Necro suck?Follow

#1 Mar 16 2011 at 2:29 AM Rating: Decent
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As the title suggests, i think the necro class sucks.

Now i'm not an uber MMO nerd, so i might be missing something here. I would love to hear any thoughts on how to play the class better.

Breakdown looks a bit like this: 41 points in Necro, 6 Dominator, 10 Elementalist.
http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=1zwsq.Excxqtkho.dMz.Vx

I am having a **** of a time in Iron Pine with this build. A few quests require me to go into some tight crypt like areas with a dense mob population. Not matter how much i spam spells to build up charge to soul purge, i get owned. My pets suck at tanking and barely do enough damage to warrant raising them from the dead. I tried the "empty the crypts" summon but it drains charge like an arch welder through aluminum foil.

It's basically becoming a pain to handle mobs that are my level range (42-44). It's honestly embarrassing with guildies who have level 50 clerics who can cut through hordes of mobs and im stuck in the rear firing off a plague bolt every 2 seconds for 400 damage, when they can down a mob in 5 seconds.

Any suggestions?
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Infernaeon 50 Necro/Chlor/Archon | Chloro | Pyromancer
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#2 Mar 16 2011 at 7:11 AM Rating: Excellent
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It could also be that your souls suck Smiley: tongue

When I played Necromancer during Beta, I used Necro/Warlock/Chloromancer. This gave me amazing survivability, what with Radiant Spores helping to heal my pet, an instant heal in case of emergencies, and Life Leech. Your soul choices seem to make very little sense to me.

-Why Elementalist, first of all. 2/3 of Elemental Link don't help, since you use undead pets, not elemental ones. The crit is nice, but most of your spells are DoTs.
-Why Dominator? Is it just for transmo? I can understand that... but your point choices are all over in this build. You don't max out any talents, making me feel like you just wanted the armor and reflect abilities and didn't actually care much about the talents.
-Some of your talent choices in Necromancer seem lackluster. 1/3 Detonate Bones? You want to keep your pet alive, so this talent has little use. Consumption would be much better, as it un-buffs an enemy while restoring your mp. Or Grave Rot, an AoE that also gives a full stack of Deathly Calling on all enemies who stay in it. Ancient Tomb probably isn't needed since you'll never use a rogue pet solo.

Next issue are the pets themselves. If you're not using the tank pet, you can't really complain about "pets suck at tanking." I think this might be exactly what you're doing because you say "pets." Use the Knight and that's all (I think it's the Knight, might be Stalwart? Whatever isn't capped at 30).

Final issue is how you're fighting enemies. Necromancer is not a sprinter - it's a marathon runner (aka, sustained damage instead of burst). They kill more slowly, but they can kill literally without any need for rest indefinitely. They can also take on 2 enemies at a time constantly - send you pet at one and tank another yourself, healing with soul purge + essence link + radiant spores + leech life. I never had an issue while leveling to 30 except for when I took 4+ enemies (usually because I had adds show up).

I could be wrong. Perhaps Necromancer is completely different at 43 than at 30. But it really seems like your soul, talent, playstyle and pet choices may be to blame, not the class itself.

Edited, Mar 16th 2011 9:13am by LockeColeMA
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#3 Mar 16 2011 at 12:40 PM Rating: Decent
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That's good feedback. Honestly i haven't played an MMO in a few years and im just now getting back into it. The reason i posted my build was to get feedback on why it's sucking. So don't worry, you didn't hurt my feelings by letting me know my build is off.

I figured that any soul had to be good in reality, it's just that i wasn't playing correctly thus making my play suck. I'll try out what you're suggesting and see if it works better.
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Estrael
Infernaeon 50 Necro/Chlor/Archon | Chloro | Pyromancer
Manberpig 21 Paladin/Warlord/Reaver
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#4 Mar 16 2011 at 12:53 PM Rating: Good
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LockeColeMA wrote:
They can also take on 2 enemies at a time constantly - send you pet at one and tank another yourself, healing with soul purge + essence link + radiant spores + leech life. I never had an issue while leveling to 30 except for when I took 4+ enemies (usually because I had adds show up).


The last part happens fairly often to me, not because theres anything wrong with the class but because it plays so smoothly and it's really easy to get carried away and start dotting everything around you haha.
#5 Mar 17 2011 at 7:42 AM Rating: Excellent
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KTurner wrote:
LockeColeMA wrote:
They can also take on 2 enemies at a time constantly - send you pet at one and tank another yourself, healing with soul purge + essence link + radiant spores + leech life. I never had an issue while leveling to 30 except for when I took 4+ enemies (usually because I had adds show up).


The last part happens fairly often to me, not because theres anything wrong with the class but because it plays so smoothly and it's really easy to get carried away and start dotting everything around you haha.

Smiley: lol
There was a time in Beta where I was in the tombs outside Granite Falls... Hallows or something? I forget the name of the area. Inside I could stand in a single spot of the room and dot up my choice of 6 enemies. By the time the last one died the first would respawn.

I sat there and did it for 10 minutes, just because I could. The floor was littered with glittering corpses by the time I was finished, and I was still at full health and mana. I just laughed at how overpowered I felt! PvP was also fun but I found my pet dying quite often. I'd usually sit in the back and dot everything while healing my allies.

The only thing I didn't like on my Necro was the lack of burst; and this is a larger problem in groups. Yes, on bosses I can dot them up and DPS very well (while throwing out some support heals too); but when there is a mechanic that requires quick damage like the crystals on the last boss of DSM, or the blood crystal transformation in AP, Necromancers' lack of burst will hurt.
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#6 Mar 18 2011 at 7:16 AM Rating: Good
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Buba,

For PVE quest grinding try a build like this:

http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=1zvw_.ceoh0Vm.xtczVdkus

For 3rd soul you can go either Dominator, Archon, or Chloro, depending on what you need/want.

Use the Knight pet, open with:

Looming Demise
Necrosis
Grave Rot (If you are pulling more than one mob)
Dark Touch
Void Bolt spam or Soul Purge (if you have a lot of Focus)

You also have Sacrifice Life: Mana and Reconstruct to refill your Health and Mana.

If you are having trouble with your Knight tanking try this: Hover your mouse over your pet bar abilities to see what they do. Read the entire tooltip for all his abilities. Spells you cast can either increase or decrease his aggro and damage abilities.

You get some very cool 1-2 CD emergency spells too like Empty the Crypts, Lich Form, etc. Use them if things get crazy. Two extremely beneficial spells are Exhume, I put this right next to my Summon icons on my bar and Feign Death if things get out of control.

Hope this helps, Necro rocks the socks off!

Kooby

edit: terrible grammar before 2nd cup of coffee!

Edited, Mar 18th 2011 10:25am by Kooby
#7 Mar 18 2011 at 8:04 AM Rating: Good
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Kooby wrote:


If you are having trouble with your Knight tanking try this. Hover your mouse over your pet bar abilities to see what they do. Read the entire tooltip for all his abilities. Spells you cast and either increase or decrease his aggro and damage abilities.


If this has been my problem with my pets in this game, im going to first slap myself then second rate you up.
#8 Apr 21 2011 at 10:12 AM Rating: Decent
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Necro is actually an amazing tree. As kinda stated above though, you

are using it totally wrong. The only tree that pairs with Necromancer

is Warlock(Since both are based on death damage). Your third tree

is where you have some choice even though it is just for the 0 pt based

ability(Dom for poly, Chloro for chance on heal buff, Archmage for

character control cd).


Starting out on launch day myself took a while to

learn rotations and pet roles too. Here's a link from Rift Junkies that

should help:


http://www.riftjunkies.com/2011/04/04/the-magic-storm-the-necromancer/


Necro Warning: This post occurred more than thirty days after the prior, and may be a necropost.
#9 Apr 21 2011 at 11:28 AM Rating: Decent
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For lvling i would suggest either using necro or ele as base and only point points into them to make the tank better, then using chloro as your main dps soul and use synthisis on your pet, your pet will never die.
With this type of build using the ele pet i can easily tank 6 mobs of my own lvl and my pet goes down to maybe 50% health every so often... i can also solo on lvl minor rifts easily (even the elites at the end)
#10 Apr 22 2011 at 12:56 PM Rating: Good
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Not sure chloro main is even necessary in that case though. Soul Purge takes care of all the necessary healing ive found.
#11 Apr 27 2011 at 9:23 AM Rating: Decent
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Heres my rotation for dispatching mobs. You can quickly down 2 mobs at your level or 4 mobs at a level below you.

Find a group of enemies and cast Life Leech on each one from range. Tab through the 2-3 monsters and individually cast Life Leech on each one. You should be able to get off 2-3 Life Leeches before each enemy can get close to you.

Do not allow your pet to run away but rather allow the monsters to come to you. This is important. You can set your pet to passive and then later command it to attack. Alternatively (if you are just killing 1-2 monsters at once), you can just follow it.

After you get off the Life Leeches, cast Necrosis and Dark Touch on each monster. Both of these are instant casts and deal damage over time (DoT).

Once all the enemies pile on top of you and all your DoTs are up, throw down Grave Rot on the ground.

With 4 DoT effects on each enemy, they will die very quickly. For any mobs you want to finish off more quickly you can use the “Neural Prod” spell on, which is an instant cast Dominator ability with solid damage plus builds charge for Soul Purge, which will let you skip casting Leech on one mob.

Do not try to cast Plague Bolt or Void Bolt if you are being attacked by a horde of enemies. DoTs and Neural Prod are just fine, hardly ever use my bolts.

When you can, use the Skeleton Stalwart as a pet; it can easily hold hate on two monsters with DoT effects if you micro it correctly.
#12 Apr 27 2011 at 10:10 AM Rating: Good
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On my necro/lock I do pretty much the following for groups of mobs:

For 2 to 3 mobs:
- Send the pet and order an attack against the furthest or the caster in a group
- Dot up that target with Necrosis and Dark Touch
- Dot the other targets with Necrosis and Dark Touch and immediately order a pet attack against them during casting so the pet builds some threat on them (his threat is a LOT stronger than your dot's threat)
- Grave Rot the group once the pet has all three, healing with Soul Purge and Blood Binding as needed

For groups larger than 3 (never tried more than 6)
- Send the pet against a caster
- Dot the caster and include Essence Link in the chain of spells
- Start up Blood Binding (keep it up)
- Life Shift spam until 100 charge then Soul Purge against the pet's target (Sacrifice Life: Mana to keep mana up, Essence Link and Soul Purge will keep you healed through that no problem)
- Switch targets as they die repeating the whole thing

The key to larger groups is not to build threat on off targets yourself (apparently healing through Blood Binding, Soul Purge, and Life Shift doesn't produce any threat) and just take them down one by one. It's not as fast since you can't use Grave Rot, but you can take on very large groups of non-elites with no issues.

If your pet somehow DOES die, just Exhume and summon another one, by then you DO need to Grave Rot and try to take the group down as quickly as you can, still it shouldn't be that big a deal since you've undoubtedly done significant damage to the group by the time that happens. Just keep healing yourself with Soul Purge and Essence Link and it shouldn't be a problem.
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#13 May 18 2011 at 5:33 AM Rating: Decent
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My brother has been playing a necromancer for 33 levels with no problems so thought he would share his experience.

he is a Necro 31/War 5/chloro 8

The Skeletal knight's first skill is bone-strike it generate additional threat if target if target is affected by necrosis and deals additional damage by 10% for each stack on deathly coil. if you want to maximize this ability I suggest pulling with plague bolt do not send the knight in first, follow up with necrosis, depending on the distance necrosis will hit first ensuring your skelly gets aggro.

The knights second skill is grave touch it is affectively his taunt. if the target is effected by looming demise grave touch deals an additional 100% damage.

The third skill for the knight is bone shatter which deals an additional 50% damage if the target is effected by necrosis it also consumes deathly calling stats from up to 5 enemies within 7 metres forcing them to attack the skeletal knight.

so when using your spells try to take that into account. This is the spell rotation that works for my brother:

plague bolt (applies deathly calling stack)
necrosis (instant DoT)
looming demise (instant debuff)
Dark Touch (warlock DoT)
essence link (Casters heal)
leech life (HoT/DoT warlock)
Withering vines (chloro HoT/DoT)
radiant spores (chloro damage heal)

but rotations are personal this may not work for you so play around, keep your DoTs up. In an emergency use soul purge to heal yourself and your pet, or use your necromancer heals be careful with your necro heals though they can kill and will kill you. If you are having trouble staying upright feign death is your best friend.
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