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10 Things Rift didn't get right out of the box Follow

#1 Sep 05 2011 at 5:58 AM Rating: Default
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there will be a lot of Blizzard/WoW references here, I'm not a WoW fanboi (anymore lol) and I DO currently play rift (have 2 50s). There are somethings Blizzard did extremely well that Trion failed to capitalize on. This is more of I wish they change things more so than a "I hate them for not having these things."

Please don't bash what I'm saying here, if you disagree please insert your fair argument :)

In no particular order;

10). Lack of web driven database. It's hard for a player to find upgrades, lists of mats to make upgrades, or even know that there are upgrades over what you have. I have always been a ZAM/Wowhead user. I spent about as much time on Wowhead as I did in WoW. I loved finding new gear each level that I could attain because I knew exactly how/where to attain them. Lack of a datamined Rift isn't just hurting sites like ZAM RIFT, it's hurting the whole community.

9). Lack of need for crafted items until late game. This should be easy to see, how many people do you see spamming trade for any crafted item sub 50? Even when the item is a very easy to get and powerful item (such as http://rift.zam.com/en/item/8CD5E3A70501010101/Logger%27s-Axe) most people find little to know reason to look for those items... Crafting as a whole is pretty arbitrary until 50... it's like a means to an end to make most items. One thing that WoW did which was interesting is applied crafted items into questing. This created markets out of thin air for people with that profession, markets that are still viable today. http://www.wowhead.com/spell=3936 anyone?

8). No player impact on the world. Everything you do is pretty pointless when you look at the world... nothing really changes, even for a little while. **** even Thrall left Orgrimmar in WoW albeit for a short time to visit Outland and see his people. you were personally thanks by one of the most powerful beings in the WoW world for reuniting his people to him. I can't even think of 1 instance of even a little bit of this... which brings me to the next issue.

7). Lack of need to read quests. I've read like 2-3 quests out of the 2 50's worth of quests I've done. Having a nice little quest-helper built into Rift sure made leveling simple... but without need to read the quests 99% of the time I have no idea wtf I'm doing besides looking at my map and following the dots. No need to read quests takes away much of the lore behind everything and takes away from natural exploration. Sure WoW has it "now" but before if you didn't have an addon you were all alone trying to find quests yourself via clues from quest text. Mankirk's Wife anyone?

6). Lack of Mini-games. What do you do when you don't feel like questing or dungeoning... PvP? Farm? where is the extracurricular activities? Fishing, cooking, first-aid, holiday events. Yes Rift has events... very very boring events "kill 9 aelfwar and suck their essence" "kill 3 plants"... What did WoW have? throw stinkbombs into Southshore, ribbon dance for an hour long xp boost, serve food to people... crazy stuff. Rift's Events are all grinding. Very little fun and the only reason you repeat them daily is for stuff... I want to chill and fish off the coast of the Dunes of Akala and land some massive game fish I can then use in a sweet recipe to boost my lady charm by 10%... yeah you don't HAVE to do fishing, it can be anything I'm just using fishing and cooking as it's what I'm familiar with.

5). GRINDING, Constant GRINDING. Everything in Rift is a grind, want to be stellar at PvP? GRIND, hours and hours of Grinding. Want to be tight with most factions? GRIND IT OUT BABY. What's worse is grinding is rewarded, not with epic hard to get Items in most cases but cheap items that are replaced usually before you're grind is over! I wanted Order of Mathos rep for http://rift.zam.com/en/item/ACC0DE960501010101/Mathosian-Spy%27s-Leather, before I could finish the grind I got http://rift.zam.com/en/item/8BE5A3C60301010101/Battlemaster%27s-Jerkin. Which made me hate The order of Mathos as much as Regulos.

4). Lack of an economy. It's been said hundreds of times in many forums, the Rift economy is in a worst state than the USA's... now that's bad. A LOT of things can improve this, let's start with the easiest, adjust recipes so they use 3 types of gathered material. Since you decided to give everyone 3 professions no one needs anything outside of what they can gather themselves to craft... that was a BAD move. Now the only time you can sell mats is if people are too lazy to farm or if it's "just" over the vendor cost. Which is another problem... the Vendor costs are massive on a lot of items which make it worthless to use the auction house. Simply vendor your stuff and profit. Lower the vendor costs, AH fees, and raise the mats needed for professions. That way your player base can control the economy's flow of platinum via the auction house. And all this will be much better once people can use ZAM Rift to find the upgrades they want crafted :D

3). Epic quest driven cinematics. The opening cut scenes were epic, I was in awe when I first saw them (even though Dragons have pug faces lol). Why didn't you carry out with more? Not many more but maybe after a couple of the Story quests you could have had a nice little story cinematic to TELL you how much you mean to the world you just helped save? I can't really say much more here but you get it.

2). Random acts of comedy. There are very few and far between things I've seen in Rift that made me lol. Just because the world is under attack by forces beyond the realm of understanding doesn't mean people can't be funny. A practical joke quest line here, a few non-important things to do that are just there to be amusing would goa long way to adding much needed "soul" to Rift.

1). Pop Culture references. This is probably the most important things I can think of that makes Telara an alien world. There is a huge lack of Easter-eggs, just cool *** things that make people say "hey check this out haha!" I have seen some nice achievements that delve into this realm but achievements aren't game play imo. They aren't a crew running around named "Begolas, Limli, and Araflorn" looking for their lost friends who were taken by Stonefield troggs or something like that. I mean that is just funny, if you bumped into such a group, wouldn't you laugh? Another thing that WoW did which Rift needs to continue, adding highly known player references in game in some sort of way. Big Red Kitty was a huge hunter blogger in WoW, to celebrate his dedication to the community Blizzard actually made a gun and named it after him. Those're the little things that build a better community.

Thanks for reading (if you did) and I look forward to feedback, or your opinions.

-TGE

Edited, Sep 5th 2011 10:51am by TheGoodEvil
#2 Sep 05 2011 at 7:39 AM Rating: Decent
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10. WoW didn't have this out of the box either.

9. WoW didn't have this out of the box either.

8. WoW didn't have this out of the box either.

7. WoW didn't have this out of the box either.

6. RIFT has puzzles and artifact-hunting.

5. Everything was a grind in WoW out of the box. Much still is.

4. WoW never had much of an economy either.

3. Both RIFT and WoW had intro cinematics out of the box, but no other cinematics.

1 + 2. True, but with exceptions.
#3 Sep 05 2011 at 7:53 AM Rating: Default
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the point is WoW pioneered what Rift has neglected. Instead of taking what WoW created and building off of that success they didn't capitalize on work already done. I didn't mean to say Blizz and WoW did all those things out of the box, but helped to create them. Rift could have took some more ideas from WoW and blown everyone's mind.

sorry for the confusion.
-TGE


Edited, Sep 5th 2011 9:54am by TheGoodEvil
#4 Sep 05 2011 at 8:49 AM Rating: Excellent
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So what you're saying is: Rift didn't have 7 years of evolution out of the box.

Yeah, I guess you've got me there.

What Rift did have out of the box is a game that worked correctly that drew inspiration from virtually every successful MMO that came before it (their dev team comes from a myriad of backgrounds in the MMO industry). They also have a game that sees major updates basically every month rather than every six to twelve months.
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#5 Sep 05 2011 at 8:53 AM Rating: Default
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Rift could have used WoW's 7 years of evolution... just saying.
#6 Sep 05 2011 at 9:53 AM Rating: Decent
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TheGoodEvil wrote:
Rift could have used WoW's 7 years of evolution... just saying.

How? Knowing it's possible to set up a feature like the armory doesn't make it take any less developer time. Blizzard has had many years to get those things done, Trion hasn't. If they had to include many of these features, the game wouldn't even have been released yet.
#7 Sep 05 2011 at 9:57 AM Rating: Excellent
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Actually, reading this again.. I'd like to go ahead and go point by point

10: Neither Trion or Blizzard had an addon API right out of the box, but Trion decided that fansites were a good thing and went ahead with periodic releases of all player-discovered information. In order to accomplish this in WoW, sites have to use a combination of data-collection addons and datamining.

9: You certainly don't NEED crafted items until endgame, but they're still better than the quest rewards. I craft new stuff for my mage all the time and she WRECKS her way through dungeons and warfronts, largely due to superior gear for her level. Often I'll go into a new dungeon and the blue drops ARE NOT upgrades over her crafted gear. So yes, it isn't REQUIRED that you do that, but it really shouldn't be, and if you do it anyway it does convey an advantage

8: I'm not sure what you mean here. Are you asking for GW2-style player impact? Because you don't even really know what that looks like yet, since that game isn't out. Rift gives players as much impact on the world as the overwhelming majority of MMOs currently on the market. Furthermore, Trion have stated that over the next couple of patches they want to release a zone that keeps a more static state until players come and do things about it

7: Read them if you want to. Interpreting badly-written quest text was one of my least-favorite things to do in WoW before the advent of QuestHelper. And I played FFXI before that, where reading quest text told you absolutely nothing.

6: Puzzles? Cairns? Artifacts? I'm sorry Rift didn't have fishing out of the box to make you a drooling vegetable... wait, no I'm not.

5: Everything in every MMO is a grind. Welcome to MMOs.

4: No economy? What? Do you mean that you can't corner a market? That's not a bad thing, but maybe I'm just not understanding your meaning here.

3: For being number 3 on your list, you don't go into a lot of detail of why you think this is such a negative. I agree that cutscenes are cool and I wouldn't be surprised to see more of them for major story events, but it doesn't seem that critical.

2: Really? This is number 2 on your top 10 list? Really? So Rift takes itself a bit more seriously than WoW. I'm fine with that. Honestly, WoW's comedic attempts get really tiresome after a while.

1: I really consider this to be the same point as #2 and also not that critical. Rift takes itself more seriously and doesn't need to indulge in stupid pop-culture references to get a cheap laugh.

Trion took what they felt were the strong points from several different games, including WoW, EQ, FFXI, etc. They left out a lot of the fluff and concentrated on producing a solid game. They roll out content patches like WoW rolls out system maintenance, and they pay attention to what's going on in their game. Personally, I feel like they've done a fantastic job so far and I'm very interested to see what they have in store for the future of Rift.

My suggestion for you is to take the game as it is. If you're trying to think of it as a WoW clone, you're doing it wrong. It's its own beast and has its own ups and downs.
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#8 Sep 05 2011 at 12:30 PM Rating: Default
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I am not trying to downplay Rift I can easily make a 20 point "what Rift did right" post, but there is something missing from the game and I've seen it referred to as "soul" the things I mentioned (which were in no particular order btw :p) were my thoughts on where they lost the game's soul. I guess trying to type up something so early in the morning (think I started it at 5am) makes it lose some of the meaning I was aiming for.

Anyway sorry for the miscommunications and such. But you have to be honest, the game feels like a SOLID game with no Soul. And you don't have to be rude...

-TGE

Edited, Sep 5th 2011 2:30pm by TheGoodEvil

Edited, Sep 5th 2011 2:32pm by TheGoodEvil
#9 Sep 05 2011 at 1:07 PM Rating: Decent
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Agreed that crafted gear is pretty spiffy, especially if you throw an augment into it. All my lowbie characters are treated to augmented crafted greens. When you first look at the gear when you're deciding what to make it's not that impressive...until you jack up the key stat for that calling by 50% with an augment. Then it's pretty hawt. And it's specifically set up so that if you want to go the crafted gear route, it's worthwhile to do so. But at the same time if you just want to plug along on quest rewards and instance drops as you level, you can do that too. Crafted gear doesn't have to be zomfgawesome...it just has to be worth taking the time to make, which it is. And if you want to take the extra time to get the really good crafted stuff as you level, you can do that too...though most people just don't care. They don't want to interrupt their leveling process or the aspects of the game they enjoy to come up with mats. There is some really good blue gear to be had through virtually all stages of the leveling process, but most people don't care about being uber while they level. They're happy to just keep doing what they're doing and worry about uber at the cap.

There are some pretty involved storylines in the game. Through all of Azeroth, Blizzard had none in WoW. Then you get to Outland and if you're lucky enough to have rolled Horde you get the quest chain from Nagrand that ends with Thrall paying Garrosh a visit and then sitting down for tea with his mom. That was pretty cool. Conversely, in Rift we didn't have to wait for an expansion to get arching storylines that in most cases were quite well done. I'd have to say that Defiant get the better ones. Uriel Chulum's series was one of the better implementations of an NPC storyline in an MMO that I've seen (especially when you get to the IPP part and you know things have started to go sideways for her and everywhere you go in that valley you come across her and the witch...I thought that was pretty neat.) You also get the Adriana Weaver storyline with that nice little snippet on the shore in the isolated cove west of Meridian. And for Guardian...well, watching Marshal Kain go a little batsh*t crazy in Stillmoor was kinda cool.

I did my fair share of fishing in WoW, but when push comes to shove if I want to stand on a shoreline somewhere and push a button every 30 seconds to fill my inventory with mediocre sh*t while chatting to guildies, I'll fill my bags with minor health pots before I go and buff myself every 30s to pretend I'm doing something useful and chat away. The artifact system is the alternative to fishing and the rewards are a lot more interesting. That's personal opinion, of course, but I can't say there would be too many people listing a lack of fishing as a serious deficiency in the grand scheme of things.

To complain about grinding in an MMORPG at this point is about the equivalent of complaining that all you do in an FPS is shoot people. That's the genre, and until studios develop the tools to magically create content faster than the players can chew through it, there will always be an element of grind to them. I also think there's a certain amount of objectivity that comes into question any time you've got someone complaining about a grind and also complaining about a lack of fishing...

Edited, Sep 5th 2011 12:44pm by Aurelius
#10 Sep 05 2011 at 3:50 PM Rating: Decent
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TheGoodEvil wrote:
Rift could have used WoW's 7 years of evolution... just saying.


. you mean when WoW separated pve and pvp damage....oh wait they did not
. oh wait you mean when they made 10 mans that are not recycled 20 mans...oh wait they did not
. you mean when they made transfers free high --> low...low --->high ...oh wait they did not
. you mean when they gave you multiple soul options...oh wait they did not
.you mean when they added in game fraps so I do not have to pay an outside company 37$ for videos?...oh wait they did not
. you mean when they added a appearance tab...oh wait they did not they waited until lost 1 million subs to a game with 2 months worth of hype and then they still half ***'d it
. you mean when they promised content faster..oh wait they did not..how is 4.2 Firelands treating you?
. you mean when they said they would give casuals more to do like single instances?..oh wait they never did


Stop defending that game run by a crappy company. Blizzard and WoW fanbois are full of constant excuses for failures. Go back here http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/984270/ and keep begging for features I get everyday in Rift and you will never see

WoW is the direct opposite of evolution. That game has stagnated this market for 7 years straight and watching it go down in flames will be GODLY. Game companies smell blood in the water and are about to tear WoW's population apart.

Keep preaching to Rift about what it is lacking. Go look at your own game then lecture us.


Edited, Sep 5th 2011 5:53pm by Puremallace
#11 Sep 05 2011 at 4:20 PM Rating: Good
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I don't think Blizzard has necessarily done a poor job, but I would agree that there seems to have been a certain element of complacency in their approach to maintaining and improving the game over the last couple of years. Let's face it...before Rift, WoW never had any real competition. Everything that came out after WoW was a flash in the pan that either slipped into the depths of mediocrity shortly after launch or just flat out bombed. Even the games that have managed to hold on with a mostly neutral community opinion (ie. LOTRO) haven't ever given Blizzard reason to stand up and take notice.

But then Rift comes along at just the right time and advances the genre (as they said they would do) and works their asses off to set themselves apart from the crowd (addition of new features that Blizzard could have added to WoW years ago if they had decided it was worthwhile).

Rift came on the scene as an underdog and underdogs always have to work harder to keep their spot. That's exactly what Trion is doing. Not everyone is going to enjoy Rift, but it's hard to level much criticism as Trion given what they launched with and what they've done with the game in the 6 short months since launch. They're one of the few MMOs since WoW that didn't launch with a list of critical flaws that sunk them before they even got started.
#12 Sep 05 2011 at 7:26 PM Rating: Default
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Puremallace wrote:
TheGoodEvil wrote:
Rift could have used WoW's 7 years of evolution... just saying.


. you mean when WoW separated pve and pvp damage....oh wait they did not
. oh wait you mean when they made 10 mans that are not recycled 20 mans...oh wait they did not
. you mean when they made transfers free high --> low...low --->high ...oh wait they did not
. you mean when they gave you multiple soul options...oh wait they did not
.you mean when they added in game fraps so I do not have to pay an outside company 37$ for videos?...oh wait they did not
. you mean when they added a appearance tab...oh wait they did not they waited until lost 1 million subs to a game with 2 months worth of hype and then they still half ***'d it
. you mean when they promised content faster..oh wait they did not..how is 4.2 Firelands treating you?
. you mean when they said they would give casuals more to do like single instances?..oh wait they never did


Stop defending that game run by a crappy company. Blizzard and WoW fanbois are full of constant excuses for failures. Go back here http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/984270/ and keep begging for features I get everyday in Rift and you will never see

WoW is the direct opposite of evolution. That game has stagnated this market for 7 years straight and watching it go down in flames will be GODLY. Game companies smell blood in the water and are about to tear WoW's population apart.

Keep preaching to Rift about what it is lacking. Go look at your own game then lecture us.


Edited, Sep 5th 2011 5:53pm by Puremallace


Considering I haven't played WoW in months and have been dedicated to Rift in that time... I'd say I was looking at my own game. Maybe you should take off your fanboi glasses long enough to see that Rift isn't all it could be. Oh wait, you can't amidoinitrite?
#13 Sep 05 2011 at 8:22 PM Rating: Decent
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Note: all of this is just my personal opinion...

In my humble opinion... many games have been clones of what came before. "Why," you might ask? Because it's not all that unusual that a developer has worked on another game before, and they take some of those experiences with them.

Imagine, for a moment, that you were to build your own game right now. Literally, imagine it for a moment. Now, anyone that says they didn't just see at least 2 or 3 games in their mind and say, "but different"... is fooling themselves.

Now as it comes to Rift, it is still a rather new game on a very unique paradigm. Not everything is going to come out of the box, and anyone that played WoW pre-BC can tell you the same thing. Every game that is maintained for longer than a year is going to have a certain learning curve (for players and developers alike). Just imagine playing Rift 3 years from now when someone talks about how bad they have it and you're the one with the, "but I played from the beginning when we walked uphill both ways in the snow barefoot".

That being said, Trion is (by far) a very receptive crew that by far listens to it's customers more than any gaming company I've seen or heard about. But in my opinion, they are coming at this from a different (and probably better) direction than Blizzard. They are getting the game right before putting in all the frills. Some bugs in Kalimdor and Eastern Kingdoms spotted from all the way back in beta remained in the game until Cataclysm.

All that being said, expressing what one would like to see is a very healthy and important part of game development, as is a lively (but respectful) discussion :)
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#14 Sep 05 2011 at 8:30 PM Rating: Excellent
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Absolutely. Every time I hear someone make a "wow clone" claim against Rift, I go ahead and trace it back for them:

WoW copied EQ
EQ copied Diku MUDs and added graphics
Diku copied AD&D
AD&D copied everyone's playground games of make believe and added dice

I could probably keep that going until the beginning of human history.

The fact is, every new entry into a genre takes some elements the designers liked from previous entries and expounds upon them.
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#15 Sep 05 2011 at 9:14 PM Rating: Default
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Archmage Callinon wrote:
Absolutely. Every time I hear someone make a "wow clone" claim against Rift, I go ahead and trace it back for them:

WoW copied EQ
EQ copied Diku MUDs and added graphics
Diku copied AD&D
AD&D copied everyone's playground games of make believe and added dice

I could probably keep that going until the beginning of human history.

The fact is, every new entry into a genre takes some elements the designers liked from previous entries and expounds upon them.


Which is exactly why I made that list :s to illustrate a few things that Rift could have added or could still add to give the game some much needed flavor. I've had many friends stop playing Rift and I am reaching that point as well :(. I have 2 50s, I play everyday when I feel up to it. But there is something missing in the game that makes it feel hollow. Idk what it is but those are the things I could think of to make it better and the "WoW killer" it wants to be.

-TGE
#16 Sep 05 2011 at 9:32 PM Rating: Good
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TheGoodEvil wrote:

Which is exactly why I made that list :s to illustrate a few things that Rift could have added or could still add to give the game some much needed flavor. I've had many friends stop playing Rift and I am reaching that point as well :(. I have 2 50s, I play everyday when I feel up to it. But there is something missing in the game that makes it feel hollow. Idk what it is but those are the things I could think of to make it better and the "WoW killer" it wants to be.

-TGE


It could be the fact Rift came out of nowhere with 2 months of hype. WoW had maybe 10 years of games to base it's LORE on because I remember playing Warcraft back when I was like 10 I think "Today is a good to die" <---great cheat code for those interested

Trion had a few choices here. They were given "x" amount of money. They could 1. make a whole bunch of cgi graphics like SWToR and invest it in voice overs ORRRRRR 2. Build a game that actually works and has all the features that makes it work + pump out content like someone is holding a gun to the devs head.

Yeah some of these games coming out might be a little more immersive and running on hype, but after that NDA goes bye bye they can no longer hide behind that curtain. I'll put 5$ on it right now EA/Bioware is not going to lift that NDA until one day before the game launches.

I am going under the assumption that as they build the game up and release more content then the story telling with CGI or whatever will get more attention.
#17 Sep 05 2011 at 9:38 PM Rating: Decent
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I had time like that in WoW myself. Those were the times I went out and did silly stuff "just 'cause" with my friends. Re-explored old dungeons to look at the artwork, sought out monuments out in the world, even testing my hunter to the limit of what it could solo.

As one of my favorite Guild Masters is quoted as saying: "When you're out there chasing gear, it comes to an end sometime. When you're out there chasing memories, the game never stops".

Check out some of our more recent news stories... there may be events that appeal to you. Not advertising, but it does really seem up your alley.
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#18 Sep 05 2011 at 10:42 PM Rating: Decent
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I read every article and every new post on this site. :)

I am a loyal fan ;)
#19 Sep 06 2011 at 4:15 AM Rating: Decent
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Puremallace wrote:
. oh wait you mean when they made 10 mans that are not recycled 20 mans...oh wait they did not

Actually they did.
#20 Sep 06 2011 at 10:33 AM Rating: Decent
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I dunno about that. The original plan at launch was to include 10- and 20-man versions of GSB and all subsequent raids going forward and they squashed that just before launch (which set of a cascade of QQ that was almost as significant as that caused by the recent valor changes). Since then, they've accommodated the 10-man raid squads with slivers, which are significantly different from the 20-man raids. Unless I've overlooked something, I think it's safe to say that Trion has not, in fact, built 10-man raids around recycled 20-man content.
#21 Sep 06 2011 at 11:06 AM Rating: Decent
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Aurelius wrote:
Since then, they've accommodated the 10-man raid squads with slivers, which are significantly different from the 20-man raids. Unless I've overlooked something, I think it's safe to say that Trion has not, in fact, built 10-man raids around recycled 20-man content.


Also do not forget. They are not just built from scratch oh that is too simple. These are literally distortions in the space-time continuum. What this means is they can literally make a entrance to a 10man in the capitol city in a alternate timeline where the city is taken over by Regulos!

The 10man content in Rift has been pretty fun actually. If I could locate Rise of the Phoenix on the pts I would provide screenshots.
#22 Sep 06 2011 at 11:55 AM Rating: Decent
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As of last time sending one of my friends to Omen Sight the world, the entrance failed to be found. May still be in development.

Edited, Sep 6th 2011 1:56pm by Nepabrite
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#23 Sep 06 2011 at 12:05 PM Rating: Excellent
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TheGoodEvil wrote:
Archmage Callinon wrote:
Absolutely. Every time I hear someone make a "wow clone" claim against Rift, I go ahead and trace it back for them:

WoW copied EQ
EQ copied Diku MUDs and added graphics
Diku copied AD&D
AD&D copied everyone's playground games of make believe and added dice

I could probably keep that going until the beginning of human history.

The fact is, every new entry into a genre takes some elements the designers liked from previous entries and expounds upon them.


Which is exactly why I made that list :s to illustrate a few things that Rift could have added or could still add to give the game some much needed flavor. I've had many friends stop playing Rift and I am reaching that point as well :(. I have 2 50s, I play everyday when I feel up to it. But there is something missing in the game that makes it feel hollow. Idk what it is but those are the things I could think of to make it better and the "WoW killer" it wants to be.

-TGE


Actually, from what you're describing, it sounds like you're hitting genre burnout. But hey, my turn to answer your 10 statements.

10. All I can say about this is echo what others said -- none of the other games started out with one out of the box either. However, the data-dump idea is definitely unprecedented and a bone thrown our way when they didn't have to.

9. You don't NEED crafted items pre-50...but that can also be flipped over and looked at as you don't NEED quested or dropped items either. If anything, it is significantly easier to start with crafted items, and then fill in what you need from quests and item drops with what your craft doesn't cover, assuming you picked a craft that will significantly help gear you. I can tell you as someone who kept tradeskills and gathering skills above my level as I was leveling (on multiple characters) that being able to have the armor/weapons available as soon as I hit that level was extremely useful, though slotting in higher level augments was a serious gamble at the time.

8. I don't know about that. If everyone ignores an invasion, pretty soon you're shut out of that zone for at least a half hour or so. Sure, it's not permanent, but neither is Thrall sticking around in Outlands. This is mostly because WoW's already got a long background to draw on though, but actions having more lasting effects was something Trion is addressing, if I was reading some of those interviews correctly.

7. You clearly did not play on the Defiant side at launch. :) The first 4-5 months of doing the Saga of the Endless quest line showcased quite well what happens when there is a quest line that does not use the quest helper to actually help and requires you to actually read the quest and explore. It was to the point where I even have a thread here for it because I got tired of seeing the same questions floating in chat every 10 minutes.

6. Like Callinon said...puzzles, cairns and artifacts. There's also achievement whoring, but that's pretty time intensive if you pick the wrong one to start finishing.

5. Grinding is a level 50ish issue. There is no real grinding before that unless you *want* there to be grinding. Just finishing quests--including taking a dive into the related instance--will finish off most things that would otherwise be a grind. Any faction you don't finish for one reason or another will finish from when you go Expert Dungeon diving at 50 or has an easy way to wrap up, so it's pretty safe to leave alone. Mathos is a special exception of a faction that doesn't have a 5-man dungeon associated with it though. If you're looking for why people will even bother raising factions to cap, you will find that some will do so because of the runes at Glorified. They tend to be BIS options.

4. Most game economies aren't that great. The people who are more in tune with Rift's game economy understand that the best way to not get ripped off is to get the materials themselves and then get a crafter to make it into something. Although they may have done it this way on purpose to help squish out the purpose of gold sellers.

3. Unfortunately, this is something that only Final Fantasy XI REALLY has covered. :)

2. There's definitely a few of those around. However, they are not necessarily in the quest directly. For example, talking to the Miner after finishing the Lucky Pick quest (Defiant side) in Stonefield is very humorous when you realize just what the Lucky Pick actually does to his family.

1. Hmmm. I'm a little hesitant to say that when they have:

No Lie!

and

Double Rainbow

in the achievement list. It's safer to say that the pop-culture references are pretty camouflaged with the game.
#24 Sep 06 2011 at 4:00 PM Rating: Decent
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Ravashack wrote:
8. I don't know about that. If everyone ignores an invasion, pretty soon you're shut out of that zone for at least a half hour or so. Sure, it's not permanent, but neither is Thrall sticking around in Outlands. This is mostly because WoW's already got a long background to draw on though, but actions having more lasting effects was something Trion is addressing, if I was reading some of those interviews correctly.

And it took years before Thrall (or anyone else) could go to Outland at all.
#25 Sep 07 2011 at 4:30 PM Rating: Decent
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9). Lack of need for crafted items until late game. This should be easy to see, how many people do you see spamming trade for any crafted item sub 50? Even when the item is a very easy to get and powerful item (such as http://rift.zam.com/en/item/8CD5E3A70501010101/Logger%27s-Axe) most people find little to know reason to look for those items... Crafting as a whole is pretty arbitrary until 50... it's like a means to an end to make most items. One thing that WoW did which was interesting is applied crafted items into questing. This created markets out of thin air for people with that profession, markets that are still viable today. http://www.wowhead.com/spell=3936 anyone?

Those quests were undeniably the worst quests in wow. They aren't around anymore in Cataclysm--and with good reason! It was NOT fun spamming trade in Org hoping an engineer would make you a blunderbuss on the cheap. As a noob, I didn't know any better than to skip that quest. By the time I rolled my second alt I skipped that quest entirely.

Quote:
7). Lack of need to read quests. I've read like 2-3 quests out of the 2 50's worth of quests I've done. Having a nice little quest-helper built into Rift sure made leveling simple... but without need to read the quests 99% of the time I have no idea wtf I'm doing besides looking at my map and following the dots. No need to read quests takes away much of the lore behind everything and takes away from natural exploration. Sure WoW has it "now" but before if you didn't have an addon you were all alone trying to find quests yourself via clues from quest text. Mankirk's Wife anyone?

Again, that was one of the worst parts of WoW. Reading quests is all well and good, but having to go back and read a quest because it's incredibly confusing is bad. If you don't read the quests, fine. If you do, there are some awesome stories like that of Scotty the dorf and Marshal Kain that you get to hear.

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3). Epic quest driven cinematics. The opening cut scenes were epic, I was in awe when I first saw them (even though Dragons have pug faces lol). Why didn't you carry out with more? Not many more but maybe after a couple of the Story quests you could have had a nice little story cinematic to TELL you how much you mean to the world you just helped save? I can't really say much more here but you get it.

I cannot stand ingame cinematics. Its a choice of taste and I'm glad Trion went the way that they did.

Quote:
2). Random acts of comedy. There are very few and far between things I've seen in Rift that made me lol. Just because the world is under attack by forces beyond the realm of understanding doesn't mean people can't be funny. A practical joke quest line here, a few non-important things to do that are just there to be amusing would goa long way to adding much needed "soul" to Rift.

I can't remember anything like this in WoW until Outland, and even then it was pretty meh (ally has to dig through **** lol). WoW didn't really get a funnybone until Wrath and then Cata.
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